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  #1  
Old 05-05-2006, 11:57 AM
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Default You Know What's Weird About Loving An Addict/Update

You know what's weird about loving an addict, is you feel so damn guilty about making the right choices. And do you know why we feel so guilty, because it's what we haven't done before.

We have let them manipulate us. We've let them steal from us. We've let them put us into debt. We've given them 3rd and 4th chances. We've let them cheat on us. We've put our lives aside trying to save their lives. We've lost who we are for them.

So when we finally put our foots down, we feel guilty. Not because we don't deserve to put our foots down, but because we feel as if we're betraying them. But all along we have been betraying ourselves for them.

It's weird how we can care for everyone else, but the moment we start caring for ourselves we feel guilty.

Just some thoughts
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Old 05-05-2006, 01:22 PM
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You have described 'co-dependency'. The weird part is when you actually start realizing that our behaviour is not normal. That is a good thing to realize. There is often more than just the addict who is sick, more than not there is a loved one who is sick with co-dependency. We allow ourselves to get sick with it and the addict needs us to be sick with it in order to manipulate us.

p.s. I think your siggy says it all
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Old 05-08-2006, 05:39 AM
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Witchlinblue,

You are so right on this one. Co-dependency is as much of an addiction as the drugs our partners use. They say the first sign is recognizing any addiction. We must first heal ourselves in order to help them heal themselves.

Thanks on the siggy
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Old 05-09-2006, 11:09 AM
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Amen to both of you!!! Being a co-dependant is sometimes very hard to see for those of us who are one... ( it is a way of life for many, until they realize what is going on) but it is so true that it is an addiction as well. When we do "wake up", we can truly begin to help our loved ones the right way after we understand and help ourselves!
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Old 05-09-2006, 11:42 AM
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Since we're on the subject of co-dependency which I am definitely. Did you know there is a whole 12 step program for co-dependency. My therapist told me about it and I google and found this great site.

http://www.coda.org/codameet.html

Hope this helps any one.
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Old 05-09-2006, 11:54 AM
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Loving the addict is hard but loving yourself is harder to do..
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Old 05-09-2006, 07:10 PM
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It's because time and time again we hear, "It's a disease" and you wouldn't abandon him if he had cancer would you? That's what makes me feel guilty and makes me stay.
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Old 05-09-2006, 07:31 PM
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Oh you are so right about the 'guilt disease' blurb. Its a great trap for anyone with a good heart. However what we all have to keep in mind is there is a big difference between someone having a disease like cancer and a disease like addiction. Often with many diseases our lives can be in the hands of the medical profession. With addiction its the addict who makes the steps towards 'remission' !!
I have felt the guilt of the 'disease' card, and I should know better since Ive battled and won the same 'disease' and found my own remission, though not a cure.
That guilt is an easy trap to get into but all our talking about it is what will give us all strength and knowledge to make the right decisions. Im so glad that so many of us can talk so freely about our fears, the guilt, and the heartbreak as well as exchanging experiences. It will give us all strength and some of the support we need. Thank God for PTO and the members who share all of these feelings. Its what keeps many from feeling alone in this forum. GROUP HUG !!!!!!!!!
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Old 05-09-2006, 09:43 PM
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ACK I HATE THAT WORD, co dependecy thats just nassy LOL sorry had to vent!

I have been that way for years but come to realize that I can do things and not feel guilty, etc. and I love myself more when my addict actually says damn its about time, even though she tried to get me to do this and that a week before, its the tough love co dependcy issue.

Have any of you ever felt like no matter what they do or what they say, you just can't see yourself without them in your life somehow?
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Old 05-10-2006, 05:48 AM
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Hightek669,

Oh I can definitely relate, yesterday I was in a store he worked at three years ago. One of the managers asked if I had seen or heard from him. When I told him where he was, she asked if I was his room mate. When I told her at the time I was his girlfriend, she had that stupid shock look on her face. I'm still finding things out and I still don't know where to stand with him.

As with any disease, we all must take the necessary steps to either heal ourselves or give up. Unfortunately many addicts just give up. It's not that their hearts aren't ready, it's the mind. They see no other way to numb the pain or to get that great feeling.

I still feel guilty after 3 years of dealing with his disease. But like you when I stand up to him, he does say it's about time. Once when he was in DOC last year he made a list of things pros and cons on me. The first thing was I give into him, no matter what, just to make him happy. It's that damn nuturing and guilt in me.

And I am very grateful I found PTO. Without you guys I would have been so lost!!!
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Old 05-11-2006, 10:30 PM
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Guilt is a common tool used by others to obtain their own desires. To learn to distinguish the truth of guilt will give you a freedom to act upon your own behalf.

False guilt continues an enabling pattern and can convince you in various ways, somehow, YOU are responsible for an addict’s behavior. False guilt accuses: You weren't strong enough or You were too strong, You weren't loving enough or You were too loving, You allowed or You didn't allow. The accusations are never-ending.

False guilt receives strength from the fact you are searching for a rational, logical explanation to the irrational, illogical behavior of a drug addict.

The two forms of guilt: Genuine guilt--that is when we violate man's law or one's moral belief. False guilt comes from misconceptions of feelings, emotions that are totally messed up or illogical, and causes a person to actually feel guilty without committing any type of violation.

The addict is a master manipulator of false guilt. His unfounded accusations suggest your guilt. A blameless addict holds the right to continue his drug use. He is always able and willing to lay blame on somebody else. Sadly, many pick up that burden because he won't. The victim then feels a need to carry that weight or burden. This false guilt then becomes an overwhelming feeling that has no definable reason. This pressing sense of guilt can slowly destroy your well being.

Realize false guilt is a method of deception and can keep us from taking a stand to better our life. Freedom of false guilt begins with TRUST. We must learn to trust ourselves and to the trust the truth.

False guilt will produce fleeting unfounded, illogical feelings of self-blame for another's actions.


Actual or true guilt is obvious and hard to run from. We are not in a drug induced state of mind, so we know when we are guilty. With all my heart, I believe we have the ability to know and understand without a doubt when we do something wrong.


Freeing yourself from deceptive false guilt is an enlightening experience. It is necessary to rid yourself of this type of guilt to make good, sound decisions for a better life. We must learn to trust ourselves.


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  #12  
Old 05-12-2006, 09:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Billy'sBabygirl
You know what's weird about loving an addict, is you feel so damn guilty about making the right choices. And do you know why we feel so guilty, because it's what we haven't done before.

We have let them manipulate us. We've let them steal from us. We've let them put us into debt. We've given them 3rd and 4th chances. We've let them cheat on us. We've put our lives aside trying to save their lives. We've lost who we are for them.

So when we finally put our foots down, we feel guilty. Not because we don't deserve to put our foots down, but because we feel as if we're betraying them. But all along we have been betraying ourselves for them.

It's weird how we can care for everyone else, but the moment we start caring for ourselves we feel guilty.

Just some thoughts
You know what you said is so true. I dont want to do this anymore. I just dont know how to do anything else anymore. Its killing me.
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Old 05-12-2006, 10:12 PM
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I feel guilt every damn day for getting mad at her that day and telling her to leave me alone and not call me, if I wouldn't have done that she wouldn't be in jail in the first damn place. She tells me its not my fault and to stop feeling guilty but deep down inside I truly regret doing that, she would have never been beaten (broken ribs,etc) by her ex boyfriend and sure as hell not gang raped by him and his sorry ass friends. What I would give to take it back.
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Old 05-15-2006, 07:40 AM
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Kellil,

I know how you feel. My best advice is to take baby steps. It seems we loose ourselves in caring for them. I actually had to sit down and take a couple of days last month and figure I what I did before he came along. I even surprise myself with what I came up with. Think of everything you use to enjoy, mine were reading, raquetball, riding bikes with my girls and just hanging out with my kids.

Start off small. But hang in there and if you need anything pm me.
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Old 05-15-2006, 07:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MonkeyBoi77
I feel guilt every damn day for getting mad at her that day and telling her to leave me alone and not call me, if I wouldn't have done that she wouldn't be in jail in the first damn place. She tells me its not my fault and to stop feeling guilty but deep down inside I truly regret doing that, she would have never been beaten (broken ribs,etc) by her ex boyfriend and sure as hell not gang raped by him and his sorry ass friends. What I would give to take it back.
You can not feel guilty for this one. She put herself in that situation. She understood your rules and choose her addiction over you. It was her decision. Granted the outcome was not what either of you would wish on your worse enemy. But there is some type of risk, everytime an addict goes to get their fix. I'm so sorry her ex-boyfriend did those things to her and I hope she is pressing charges against them. But you DID NOT do this to her. You were only looking after your best interest "YOU". I know how hard it is to put your foot down and you should be proud of yourself for finding the courage to speak up. Yes you can feel remorse for what happen to her, but please do not feel as if you did this to her, and by feeling guilty that is what you are doing.

If you need anything, please do not hesitate to pm, write me or just ask!
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Old 05-25-2006, 02:49 PM
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Default Just wondering...thats all

Do we continue to support them and pick up the pieces everytime they realize they have done wrong....which is usually when they are in JAIL...then when they get out........... they seem to forget about stayig sober for months at a time and all the promises and hopes they had for themselves while they were "Locked Up"
When should enough be enough?
When do they actually get clean. I feel like if i give up now, what if he really means it this time. He has no family, burned most of his bridges with others. Why should i keep supporting him after all the LIES, and horrible things that he has done? Keep thinking and praying he will get back to who i loved, does that ever happen though? I have seen him self destruct over four years and it get worse with each passing year and incarceration. He is lucky to be alive honestly.

Thoughts anyone?
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Old 05-25-2006, 03:04 PM
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BBG I know I can't feel guilty and you are right, she even told me this but sheesh deep down it hurts ya know.

Honestly I dont know if they ever get clean I mean they can be sober for years but you can't take away the urges and wants for the drug/booze.
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Old 05-26-2006, 04:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by simplegirl
Do we continue to support them and pick up the pieces everytime they realize they have done wrong....which is usually when they are in JAIL...then when they get out........... they seem to forget about stayig sober for months at a time and all the promises and hopes they had for themselves while they were "Locked Up"
When should enough be enough?
When do they actually get clean. I feel like if i give up now, what if he really means it this time. He has no family, burned most of his bridges with others. Why should i keep supporting him after all the LIES, and horrible things that he has done? Keep thinking and praying he will get back to who i loved, does that ever happen though? I have seen him self destruct over four years and it get worse with each passing year and incarceration. He is lucky to be alive honestly.

Thoughts anyone?



We do it until we finally figure out that WE Cant SAVE Them but We can SAVE ourselfs!! Sometimes they never get back to the person that we loved at one point. Are you sure that you what you feel is Love and not Pity for him cause everyone turned their back on him. I wish you the best. I have not been with my ex in like 6 years but when it was first over if felt like the world had been lifted off my shoulders but I did find myself with someone alot like my ex it took a couple years to get it right... leaving him.. I wish you the best..
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Old 05-26-2006, 04:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by simplegirl
Do we continue to support them and pick up the pieces everytime they realize they have done wrong....which is usually when they are in JAIL...then when they get out........... they seem to forget about stayig sober for months at a time and all the promises and hopes they had for themselves while they were "Locked Up"
When should enough be enough?
When do they actually get clean. I feel like if i give up now, what if he really means it this time. He has no family, burned most of his bridges with others. Why should i keep supporting him after all the LIES, and horrible things that he has done? Keep thinking and praying he will get back to who i loved, does that ever happen though? I have seen him self destruct over four years and it get worse with each passing year and incarceration. He is lucky to be alive honestly.

Thoughts anyone?
I don't know when we give up. I think just like them we all have our "Rock Bottom". I'm probably near mine. Like you I have been in this a little over 3 years. And every letter, visit or phone call from him. I'm right there wanting to believe so bad in someone who has disappointed me time and time again. Also like you he has no one. My therapist always ask me "Is this your fault, he has no one". The answer is always a simple one, "NO", it's not my fault, it's not your fault. It's their fault for all their lies and conning, no one wants to be around them.

So when do we hit rock bottom, I don't know.
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Old 05-26-2006, 04:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MonkeyBoi77
BBG I know I can't feel guilty and you are right, she even told me this but sheesh deep down it hurts ya know.

Honestly I dont know if they ever get clean I mean they can be sober for years but you can't take away the urges and wants for the drug/booze.
Please hang in there. I know it hurts deep down and everytime you feel that, remember the worst didn't happen and you're there now.

I remember when he use to go out. Every single time he would get pulled over or stopped by the police, I would wake up screaming his name at the same moment. He would come home and before he'd even get in the door, I would ask if he was okay and what happened. He would stand there in shock looking at me. Then he would tell me. I was able to save him from alot of things, the one thing we can't save them from or prevent them from is themselves. I think it's the one thing we really want to do and we can't and that's why we feel guilty. It's always, if we had or maybe we didn't. I'm learning to change that to if they had or if they didn't. And maybe that's the attitude we need to get.

I'm always here.
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Old 05-26-2006, 07:32 PM
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hi i have a son which is father billy is in hagerstown maryland jail which he has put us though everything you name it he has done know as afather he wants to try to do right so i am so confused do or don't i let him back in drugs i don't want around the kids so really how do you move on or do u wait for him
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Old 05-26-2006, 08:24 PM
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I have spent so many years picking up the peices for Jeffrey everytime he falls I really dont know how to do anything else. I can say the words "I cant save him" but to feel that, to know that. Thats something I dont know how to do. It is so hard because he would be the perfect man for me without the drugs. And he was out, clean and living with me building a life for a year this time. Thats what makes it so hard. With his prison time, he was actually clean for 3 years this time so WTF????????
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Old 05-26-2006, 09:20 PM
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I know the feeling, when they are clean and sober.... no drugs they start to go back to that person you fell in love with and you start having all kinds of HOPE again that you may be able to have REAL life with them. I hate that part because i always get so excited and then it doens't happen and i say to myself "why did i beleive it again?" I could have other people in my life that would treat me and my son they way we deserve to be treated...but do i love them like i love the other? NOPE, will i ever be able to move on with out him and be HAPPY or will i always go through the motions thinking to myself "I wish i was with charles?"
It's all so damn frustrating!!! Maybe i am sacred to actually have REAL HONEST GOODNESS around me...i think deep down inside i may think i don't deserve it...so i hold onto something that is not definite!!! I am so rambling now so i will go...had to get it out!
SO LOVE THIS PLACE!!! THANKS FOR READING!!
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Old 05-27-2006, 11:24 AM
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I truly understand what you mean. The problem is, they have to want to HELP themselves, before any changes can happen. No matter how much we love them, loving them cannot change them Years and years I watched my now husband 'escape' by using alcohol and drugs ( using drugs in my presence or home was not done, had to put my foot down there, for my son's sake) and he finally hit HIS rock bottom...currently serving a life sentence for an incident that occurred during a struggle when he and the other party were both drinking. He and I were apart at that time, but I had never stopped loving him. Looking back, I should have tried to get him into rehab, instead of walking away at all; it may have saved him from what he is facing now. One of the best ways to stop the addictive behavior is for them to totally drop all current acquaintances, avoid old neighborhoods, anything and everything concerning their addiction. You may want to attend some AA meetings or NA meetings yourselves, it can help you with codependency as well as give you some extra knowledge. Hugs!
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Old 05-31-2006, 06:54 AM
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I picked up the pieces for him so many times as well. His parents have too. I am his last sense of hope for a normal life. But does that give him the right to destroy not only his life as well as my children and mine. I used think this was all because I wasn't strong enough to make him see how good life could really be. I have since come to the conclusion, addicts are very selfish people. They will con, blame and point the finger at anyone just so they can get their next fix. This is where the guilt comes in at least for me.

How many times do we take them back, knowing it won't last long? I can't answer that for anyone, not even myself. We all have different thresholds. We have different wants and needs. Some of us are stronger than others.

It's weird loving an addict. You can't explain any of the things we do to just the average person, they will never understand. You can logic it out in your mind all the time, but when you tell someone else they look at you as if you have lost your mind.

I have found to love an addict, you must first and foremost trust your heart and listen to your gut instincts. If it's not adding up, then it never will. Second, you have to let them fall. And not just a little all the way. Mine changes his wants everytime I see him now. I don't let him know that after every visit gets me crying, because I can hear beyond the BS lies and stories. Do I think he has hit rock bottom, not yet. Will he ever, only time will tell. Have I moved on, not yet, but the thought has crossed my mind a thousand times. Why haven't I because I keep remembering the good side of him. The side that makes me laugh and gives me dimples in my knees. The side that picks me up and swings me around in the world largest hug. The side that was always there when I got home from work and no matter what day he had took 20 minutes to find out how my day was. The one who taught my daughter her multiplication table, by spending 2hrs for 2 months sitting down with her. The one who I can beat at gin rummy everytime.

The side that make me run, the feigning, the conning, the stolen stuff from my house, the one who took my car and totalled it. and on and on.. is the one I can't ever live with again.

So how do we choose, I don't have a clue, but I know I can't fix him. Only he can fix him. Only he can want to be fix and until then it's like using school glue on a piece of porcelin that really needs super glue, it will stay fix for a bit but will eventually break again.
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From the depths of their souls to to the depth of yours, addicts have a way with making us love them!!!! Billy's Babygirl


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