People who have had sentences COMMUTED and got off death row

[Dellafonte]

Hello,
I see lots of information about people who have been exonerated from Death Row, but what about those who had their sentences COMMUTED? I want to know about people who were on Death Row but had sentences reduced to time served, life, or life w/ out parole. I have a penpal on Florida's death row. He won't get exonerated, but I am hoping he will get his sentence commuted and someday be free. Is this a possiblity? Has it happened in the past? Share stories please!

[whiz-bang]

The U.S. Department of Justice's Bureau of Justice Statistics has a Website with lots of data. Try <www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/>.

The New York Times has almost certainly run stories on this topic. Try <www.nytimes.com> and use their search engine OR, if you have a library card, log onto your library's home page and search its data bases for the Times.

Good luck,

Frank Driscoll

[Ms. Begum]

Originally Posted by Dellafonte

Hello,
I see lots of information about people who have been exonerated from Death Row, but what about those who had their sentences COMMUTED? I want to know about people who were on Death Row but had sentences reduced to time served, life, or life w/ out parole. I have a penpal on Florida's death row. He won't get exonerated, but I am hoping he will get his sentence commuted and someday be free. Is this a possiblity? Has it happened in the past? Share stories please!

Hello Dellafonte,

Yes, there is a possibility. I have a penpal who has managed to have his death sentence overturned and he's currently in general population. He has a new trial coming up sometime this year. There is a chance he will be out in 10-15 years after his resentencing. For privacy reasons, I cannot expand about the details, but I'd like you to know that there are definitely possibilities.

MB

[Dellafonte]

Thank you both so much for your help/words of encouragement. How does an inmate go about getting a sentence commuted? I konw if my pp went to retrial it would happen for him w/ out a doubt, but how does he get a retrial when his appeals are always denied? And is there a way to commute sentence w/out a retrial? I'm in the dark about all of this but DESPERATELY want to help. THANKS AGAIN!

[jennie_ie]

www.freekenneth.com

He was hours away from death when Governor Perry commuted Kenneth's Death Sentence to Life.

[sammy whiteside]

I had to friends on death row. I was released from La. Jan. One friend got life with out and then commuted to 60 years and is now home and a lawyer in Baton Rouge. The other was a childhood friend who got his death overturned and is now serving life with out. He is working on that now also. Both did all there own legal work, so it can be don. After serving nearly a decade in the system. If I had the option of death or life with out I myself would rather die. This is my personal feeling on life.

[Cloudy]

Kevin Youngs sentence is also commuted to life! he had a date: aug. 21st.

Good news!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[welshcake]

thats's good news.

[techietype]

In 1972, the U.S. Supreme court handed down a decision called Furman v. Georgia that commuted every death sentence in the country. As a result, the approximately 600 people on death row had their sentences reduced to whatever the maximum penalty was short of death was in their state. It is interesting to point out that not everyone on death row was there for murder. Before 1972 people were sometimes sentenced to die for rape and (rarely) even robbery.

Life without parole was not as common a sentence as it is today, and in cases where parole was an option the amount of actual time served for murder was much less than it would be today. As a result, many former death row inmates eventually were freed.

At the time of the decision, there were forty seven men on death row in Texas. In their 1994 book, The Rope, the Chair, and the Needle -- Capital Punishment in Texas 1923-1990, the authors track what happened to those 47 men. By 1988, thirty one of the forty seven had won their freedom. Of the thirty one who were released, six had their paroled revoked, three died, and twenty three were free. While that may sound like pretty good news, there was one very terrible thing that happened.

One of those whose sentence was commuted in 1972 was a man named Kenneth McDuff. He was very unfortunately paroled in 1989, and went on a killing spree that eventually landed him once again, on death row. McDuff was almost single-handedly responsible for doubling the amount of time people sentenced to life for murder in Texas must serve before becoming eligible for parole.

[welshcake]

a book has been written by a journalist called JOAN CHEEVER about the men who got let off Death Row in 1972 under that ruling......it is very interesting.

[techietype]

Originally Posted by welshcake

a book has been written by a journalist called JOAN CHEEVER about the men who got let off Death Row in 1972 under that ruling......it is very interesting.

I am not familiar with that book. Could you tell us a little more? The book I mentioned only talked about Texas. How did the other 500+ ex-death row inmates do?

What I find interesting about the "class of 72" is that it's pretty clear that most stayed out of further trouble. It sort of blows a hole in the argument that such people are supposed to be the worst of the worst, and can never be allowed to ever be free again in order to protect the public. Therefore, they must be killed.

[Joy]

Originally Posted by techietype

I am not familiar with that book. Could you tell us a little more? The book I mentioned only talked about Texas. How did the other 500+ ex-death row inmates do?

What I find interesting about the "class of 72" is that it's pretty clear that most stayed out of further trouble. It sort of blows a hole in the argument that such people are supposed to be the worst of the worst, and can never be allowed to ever be free again in order to protect the public. Therefore, they must be killed.

Thanks for all the information. In the eyes of those who are pro death penalty they would say that even though only one went off to murder again, that would be one too many.

How would you counter that arguement? I can understand that arguement. While you could say why punish the others for one man's "mistake". The families of the victim's would say why do I have to be punished for one man's mistake? It seems like a no win situation. Do you give those that would change and make something of their lives a chance at freedom again, or do you err on the side of safety and either 1) keep them in prison for life 2) kill them all.

I would love to hear other (constructive thought provoking) thoughts about this.

[techietype]

Originally Posted by Joy

Thanks for all the information. In the eyes of those who are pro death penalty they would say that even though only one went off to murder again, that would be one too many.

How would you counter that arguement? I can understand that arguement. While you could say why punish the others for one man's "mistake". The families of the victim's would say why do I have to be punished for one man's mistake? It seems like a no win situation. Do you give those that would change and make something of their lives a chance at freedom again, or do you err on the side of safety and either 1) keep them in prison for life 2) kill them all.

I would love to hear other (constructive thought provoking) thoughts about this.

Despite it's long-time reputation for draconian laws, it was only within the past few years that Texas has had life without parole (LWOP) for murder on the books. Either they killed you or you were eligible for parole at some point. Those were the only choices given to the sentencing jury, because LWOP was opposed by the pro-killing crowd in Texas.

Politically well-connected groups like Justice for All fought and successfully blocked any effort to make LWOP an alternate sentence for murder. Their reasoning was that they wanted to kill people. If jurors were certain that the defendant was never going to be set free they would opt for life over death. One of the qualities that sets vengeance apart from justice is that there never seems to be a harsh enough penalty for a given crime.

There are two types of arguments about the death penalty -- pragmatic arguments such as the cost of the death penalty vs. life or matters of public safety, and moral arguments such as whether killing a defenseless person is ever morally justified, or whether setting a person guilty of a very heinous crime satisfies the interest of justice. I will confine this discussion solely to the pragmatic side.

In my humble pragmatic opinion, LWOP is a completely acceptable alternative to the death penalty. It is in essence, death by incarceration, but it protects the public and at the very least allows for people to be set free if new evidence of their innocence is discovered. Even Kenneth McDuff was no threat to the public as long as he was kept safely behind bars. Supporters of state-killing will argue that he would have never had a chance to kill again if he had been executed the first time, but had LWOP been on the books in the late 1960s the same would be true. Even without LWOP, McDuff was pretty clearly a high-risk person who should never have been paroled. But at the time, Texas prisons were over-crowded and the federal government was breathing down the state's back to do something about it. Hence, a sociopathic sexually motivated killer was set free.

Once of the problems with the death penalty is that executing innocent people is a statistical inevitability. Even if the error rate is only .1% (an error rate that strikes my much lower than reality) we will kill one innocent person for every thousand that we execute. Since 1976 when the death penalty became legal again, we have executed almost 1,100 people. How is executing a completely innocent person better than setting someone free to murder again? In either case an innocent person dies.

The other problem that I see is that no two murders ( and murderers) are the same. There are a number of cases where someone was executed for a minor role in a murder while the triggerman got a lesser sentence. Sometimes people are coerced against their will into participating in a murder by a strongly dominant cohort (I know of two women who were so involved). In some states coercion is not a defense for murder.

There are some people who are obviously forever dangerous and should never be freed. But what about those who are just the opposite? Does it make sense to pay tens of thousands of dollars keeping them locked up? Does it even make sense from a justice standpoint?

[Joy]

Techietype...... you gave me some things to think about. Thank you

[techietype]

There was one additional thing that I forgot to mention. In the case of a convicted murderer being set free to murder again, there is a clear failure of the state to make the right decision. If the state can get it wrong when it releases people, isn't the possibility just as high that they get it wrong when it comes to killing them?

[Lauren_M]

Originally Posted by techietype

I am not familiar with that book. Could you tell us a little more? The book I mentioned only talked about Texas. How did the other 500+ ex-death row inmates do?

What I find interesting about the "class of 72" is that it's pretty clear that most stayed out of further trouble. It sort of blows a hole in the argument that such people are supposed to be the worst of the worst, and can never be allowed to ever be free again in order to protect the public. Therefore, they must be killed.

You may be interested in reading "The Death Penalty in America - Current Controversies" Most of it can be found in Google Books. Just search the title.

While heavily biased against Capital Punishment, it does have, I believe, most of the context of the Loyola study on the Furman commuted inmates. Of course, the study is almost 20 years old but...FWIW.

Joan Cheever's book is called "Back from the Dead". There was no Google preview but you should be able to find it at your local library or bookstore. That one, too, appears to be heavily biased on the anti-capital punishment side.

Keep in mind that numbers can be bent any way you want. As Mark Twain said, “There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics.”

**edited for atrocious grammatical errors**

[JKB's Girl]

Originally Posted by Dellafonte

Hello,
I see lots of information about people who have been exonerated from Death Row, but what about those who had their sentences COMMUTED? I want to know about people who were on Death Row but had sentences reduced to time served, life, or life w/ out parole. I have a penpal on Florida's death row. He won't get exonerated, but I am hoping he will get his sentence commuted and someday be free. Is this a possiblity? Has it happened in the past? Share stories please!

My guy served 5-1/2 years on death row before having his sentence commuted in the early 80's to life with the possibility of parole. He has now been in for 30 years and despite the approval of the parole board here cannot make his way past the governor's desk for approval. This despite the fact that the majority of the parole board is hand picked by the governor.

Parole for lifers has clear political implications that most lily livered politicians will not touch with a ten foot pole.

[MJG'S_B]

I will apologize first by saying I did not read every post here..I am kinda rushing out the door as I type this...but I just wanted to say..incase no one else has...my bf is on DR, and I've had to read and learn about this process. And from what I have read...about 80 to 85% of all people who are sentenced to death, usually get their sentence commuted to life. Of course this is what I am praying for. You'd have to check your state on the specifics of this percentage. But over all in america I believe this is close to accurate. More people are sentenced with it every year than what actually stay on the row. But I could be completely wrong too...I just know I've read this somewhere.

[techietype]

Originally Posted by MJG'S_B

I will apologize first by saying I did not read every post here..I am kinda rushing out the door as I type this...but I just wanted to say..incase no one else has...my bf is on DR, and I've had to read and learn about this process. And from what I have read...about 80 to 85% of all people who are sentenced to death, usually get their sentence commuted to life. Of course this is what I am praying for. You'd have to check your state on the specifics of this percentage. But over all in america I believe this is close to accurate. More people are sentenced with it every year than what actually stay on the row. But I could be completely wrong too...I just know I've read this somewhere.

I hate to be the one to break this to you, but most people sent to death row do not wind up getting their sentences commuted to something less than death. That may have been true during the 1970s and 80s, but it isn't true now. In a few states, such as Texas, the odds are that a person sent to death row will eventually be executed. But in most states, the odds of actually being executed are fairly remote. Louisiana has executed quite a few people over the past 30 years, but most of those occurred during the 1980s and 90s. The film Dead Man Walking was based on a case in Louisiana. Fortunately, the pace of executions in that state seems to have slowed down quite a bit in recent years.

Instead of being executed, a death sentence usually stretches into many long years. In California, for example, there have only been 13 executions since 1976, but there are almost 700 people on death row, some of them there for 20 years are more. It becomes a de facto life sentence with a possibility of someday being executed, even if in most cases the possibility is small.

Wish the news was better, but I figured you wanted to know the truth.

[ohiolove]

Originally Posted by techietype

But in most states, the odds of actually being executed are fairly remote.

but that does mean that most prisoners on DR aren't actually executed, right? whether they get their sentences commuted or not?
did I understand you correctly?

Originally Posted by Ms. Begum

I have a penpal who has managed to have his death sentence overturned and he's currently in general population.

is that the way it usually goes?
my man is on DR, and his appeals are going quite well *knock on wood* and I was wondering, if he gets his death sentece overturned do you know if he will be moved to gen pop awating new trial?

if he gets a new trial, could he get the death sentence again, or is that off the table?

[Springbreak]

If a D/row inmate gets a new trial, yes they can get given the death sentence again. Sorry.

[techietype]

Originally Posted by ohiolove

but that does mean that most prisoners on DR aren't actually executed, right? whether they get their sentences commuted or not?
did I understand you correctly?

I can only give some examples. California has one of the largest death rows in the country, with about 670 condemned inmates, many of whom have been waiting to die for over 20 years. Since 1976, there have been only 13 executions in that state.

That's what I meant when I said the odds of getting executed in most states are fairly remote. The chances of a death row inmate dying of natural causes are probably greater than the chance of them being executed. But not all death penalty states are like California. In states such as Texas, Oklahoma, Virginia, Missouri, and Florida the situation is considerably worse. Those five states alone are responsible for 66% of all executions since 1976. There are 37 states with the death penalty.

Does that clarify things?

[kiwideb]

Originally Posted by techietype

I can only give some examples. California has one of the largest death rows in the country, with about 670 condemned inmates, many of whom have been waiting to die for over 20 years. Since 1976, there have been only 13 executions in that state.

That's what I meant when I said the odds of getting executed in most states are fairly remote. The chances of a death row inmate dying of natural causes are probably greater than the chance of them being executed. But not all death penalty states are like California. In states such as Texas, Oklahoma, Virginia, Missouri, and Florida the situation is considerably worse. Those five states alone are responsible for 66% of all executions since 1976. There are 37 states with the death penalty.

Does that clarify things?

Ohio is another state that executes a high percentage and should be included in your stats. (one a month is the 'deal' in Ohio! )

[techietype]

Originally Posted by kiwideb

Ohio is another state that executes a high percentage and should be included in your stats. (one a month is the 'deal' in Ohio! )

I really never intended what I said to be the start of a contest. Those states that I listed are/were simply the top five executioners at the start of 2008. You do raise a good point though. Ohio has been largely inactive as an executioner, but that sometimes changes. That type of change could be due to a court decision or to a politician who decides to make their reputation by being "tough on crime."

The bottom line is that regardless of the state, if you are sentenced to death the possibility exists that you will be killed one day.

[kiwideb]

Originally Posted by techietype

I really never intended what I said to be the start of a contest. Those states that I listed are/were simply the top five executioners at the start of 2008. You do raise a good point though. Ohio has been largely inactive as an executioner, but that sometimes changes. That type of change could be due to a court decision or to a politician who decides to make their reputation by being "tough on crime."

The bottom line is that regardless of the state, if you are sentenced to death the possibility exists that you will be killed one day.

Oh I never intended it to be a 'contest'... merely an observation reflecting Ohio's status this year and next year... I have a loved on on Ohio's DR who was recently given a date!... and you are right.... in that the bottom line is that the possibility exists that you may be killed one day if you have been sentenced to death.